What makes great MilSim to you?

[bgallion]

Well Joe Joe, I understand where you are coming from.  And I acknowledged all the people who share your view in my post above. Its just not your cup of tea.  You said you signed up and paid to play a game... yes exactly.  If you wanted the MilSim experience, you would sign up and pay to go to a MilSim game.  But you don't want to.  Because it is not what you LIKE to do. 

The problem with your question is that there are infinitely many answers.  Every one has a different reason.  Here are a few:
     - They are still in high school.  (They can't enlist)
     - They are veterans.              (Been there, done that, enjoyed that, now they want to relive that on an occasional basis)
     - They don't actually want to kill people.  But they enjoy the simulation of battle and the atmosphere of the Military.
     - They like to challenge themselves.  (Patrolling 2 clicks at night and arriving at your destination with a full ruck sack and everything is tough.  And fun to some people. (Me)
     - Maybe their goal in life is to raise a family and they don't want to have a military family but they enjoy the Military culture.  So they get their "fix" on the weekends through MilSim.
     - Maybe a friend told them, "Hey, you should come out and try this with me." They end up loving it but they are already too old to join the military.     
     - Maybe they are not qualified to join?  Maybe they had a medical disqualification in MEPS.  But that doesn't mean that they can't do MilSim.
     - Maybe they are just too out of shape to join.  Or they just do not want to get into shape to join.   
     - The list goes on..... and on... and on....

After all, in the service one receives the training, equipment and experience of doing the stuff for real that airsoft can only (to varying degrees) simulate.

First off, nothing is like the real thing.  That why we call it simulation.  As for training, equipment, and experience... nothing is like the real thing.  But what if you do not want the real thing?  What if you just like the simulation.  In that case, EASTWIND puts on training events to better your skills so that you can perform better.  There is One Shepherd that puts on leadership training events that you can go to.  In both cases you get to use night vision (that's always fun and cool).  At EASTWIND they are constantly bringing in new toys to add to the experience.  Thermal imagery device is one of them.  In One Shepherd, you get to use MILES gear.  Basically, you get to do some of the fun and cool things that you can only do in the military but without actually joining.  Thus, you can live your civilian life as you wish.

Joe, it comes down to this... People do MilSim because its what they LIKE to do.  Its a hobby, and not everyone shares the same hobby.  Just like you enjoy playing pistol nights and playing in the CQB.  Wait, if you like to do the CQB and everything, why don't you just go join the Police Department and tryout for SWAT??  See Joe, it's just a hobby.  An activity or interest pursued for pleasure or relaxation and not as a main OCCUPATION.

Does that answer your question?

[Dragon]

BGallion...

That was a fantastic answer.  

 Frustrated yes, but not exactly because you posted what you posted. ( it just happened to dredge up allot of what I've been facing of late. )

 I was a bit sarcastic... I was really trying to more exaggerate the topic, but it did come across as sarcastic.  

 On the subject of Eastwind... it is a Event where I did consider "trying it out". I was gonna go as a day player, and reading some of the topics posted by others on it... made me second guess even spending the cred to get period specific gear.  The icing on the cake was, if I stayed through the event... I had to live just as a soldier did during the off hours, camp uncomfortably ... and it just left a pit in my stomach ... like Joe said... I did that for real. It wasn't fun. I'm sure it'd be different in a MilSim event... it can't get as hairy as real Mil I know... , but It just didn't sit well, and was the #1 reason, I thought it wasn't for me.
And that it seemed the more hardcore players, kept saying that day players didn't get much out of it anyways, so I figured it'd be best I didn't go through it.

I MIGHT give it one shot though in the future. The way you described it leads me to think I am missing out on something in it.

I may fall short of the hardcore expectations, not only in my own thoughts and desires of the Hobby... , but as an Event planner. I'd rather folks treat it as fun, and a hobby... with in their own limits, and I know I must cater to a diverse mindset and crowd in order to be successful at it.

 I do think, OKI series, is Mil-Sim enough... that it does deserve the title, it's just enough, and an almost perfect combination of the blend of the hobby of airsoft, and the hobby of MilSim. 600+ players/Operators seemed to think so as well.  
Some may think IT is too hardcore, and not like to do that.  I thought it was very fun, and I honestly can't wait until OKi7 , because I know it's going to be even better.

 The bad part ,from your perspective or take on things,  ... is that I don't think ANY airsoft avenue, be it titled MilSim of not, can get away from the F on F aspect at all.  I didn't go to Eastwind... but I still think it was force on force, just with more objectives and missions tossed in.
( Your snippet sounded very awesome , no doubt about it. I  LOVE Recon duty! I'm not a good "sniper" though, don't have the patience for it. Give me the DMR, and a way to get to the location... I can do that though!  )

Just please don't think you discouraged me.  I think maybe I should have waited to respond when I wasn't tired last night.  
I really did need a more serious, "Hard-core" Operator's input.

 I like your input and knowledge.  I salute you for what effort you put into the hobby, and I can only dream of being so absolute in my own "version" of the hobby.  I simply can't go that far into it... don't have the inner desire to take it to that level for my own needs.

 I was in the Army. I did serve.  I try my best not to brag about it.  There are things I'd like not to know and forget. It wasn't just the "job" ... it was the entire lifestyle, and what you were ordered to do... often conflicted with my own personal morals and code of ethics.
I don't want to be known as "that guy who served" , I'd rather be known as "that guy who is trying his best to bring something fun, amazing, and wonderful ... affordable entertainment to everyone who desires it and NEEDS it in their life. "

I have my days and moments, but I don't try to be a "bad guy" at all.

 I know, before Airsoft... I was very down, and in a mental state of depression.  
I wasn't getting exercise. I wasn't being social.  
All it took, to bring me out of that state, was ONE small game of airsoft with a small church group down in Siloam Springs AR... , and I snapped out of my mode, and wanted nothing more than to share that wonderful joy and get people outside and doing something other than... focusing inward, and not getting to experience the thrill of it all.

 Airsoft and MilSim, might not be for everyone. Trust me, I've met some doozies out there along the way.
But for those that it IS for... it's so much more than a game or hobby.  It is a positive hobby, that can and will transform your life into doing things like, bettering yourself physically, interacting with other people, and gives everyone something to look forward too that partakes in it.

 I know it helped me. I have a blast with it! I've never been so successful in life before it.
And I know... if just One person out there, only gets a fraction of what I got out of it all... then the entire world, and that person will be 100%+ that more blessed, and have fun while doing it.

I at least .. try.  

I  don't get everything right. I'm not perfect by any means at all.

I put in the effort though.  

Alrite, enough of all that .. back on topic.  
Keep the thoughts rolling.

@ Joe...

If someone is really into Mil-Sim, then why not enlist?

Ya know, I can't answer that question.  I've asked myself that before too... but I at least do know, the Real Thing, and MilSim as far as Airsoft is concerned... even though similar, are two different aspects entirely.

 I honestly think, if you rounded up say 100 of the most "hardcore" MilSimmers out there, and they enlisted ( unless they've already served mind you, were are talking about new blood going into Military life.) ... 90 of them would wash out, most of them in Basic... which isn't actually as hard as it gets at times. Others would wash because of injury, or later on as they get into the more serious training.

10 of em, would probably feel right at home, and do just fine.. if not excel at it.

@ Everyone,

 Everyone that has posted here, be it more airsoft minded... or more MilSim minded, is helping me achieve my goal to bring forth the ideas in my head, and how to apply them, so everyone gets something they like and desire to do.

[Dragon]

oh, BTW.. I've never played CoD... nor do I play many video games at all.

I like Zombie shooters , and I play Some RPGs on the Comp.. but I'm not hard core into that stuff either.

 So, I don't really know what the hype is on CoD... lol.

[Metal]

I too hate CoD. I hate ANY game that pretends that because your gun has a red and blue tiger stripe camo paint job, it is somehow better. Or that the physics of the rounds that each gun shoots is way off to the point that say the M9 is somehow more deadly than the 1911 which is completely the other way around in real life.

To answer your question Joe, I am more like of these guys that Bgallion mentioned. I enjoy the realism of the high level milsim, yet I do not actually wanna be out killing people or have the possibility of being killed myself. I have no doubt that I could serve in the military and live up to any task they challanged me with. I was actaully planning on serving as soon as I got out of high school but I talked of to my dad about it. He said of coarse that he hated the idea but would support me in any decision seeing as it was ultimately MY decision. He pointed out that I liked to think for myself too much, and the military does NOT tolerate much of that. He also pointed out that if I was too much of a free thinker and caused too much trouble that they could easily dishonorably disharge me and that would totaly f** up the rest of my life. My dad said because of that alone that I would hate being in the military. He then said he knew this to be a fact because I was too much like him. lols.

My little brother is joining the Air Force officially as of October 4th this year. My hat is off to him for that. He is going to have his school paid for and have the Air Force help jump start his life. He is actually considering a career in the military if he likes it. Honestly, if the job situation doesn't get better soon, I think I'll be looking into going into the Marines and just bite my lip while I'm there for the better of my wife and possibly my family.

[Joe]

Thank you for sharing your thoughts, gentlemen.  I think I now have a better understanding. 

I am enjoying this thread.  Thought-provoking posts, all. 

[bgallion]

I realized I worded something in a bad way in my earlier post.  When I said OKI is not MilSim... that is not what I meant.  Of course its MilSim. lol I meant to say it is not the level of MilSim in which I prefer.  Is it fun? Yes!  I just enjoy the EASTWIND level of MilSim more.  And to clarify, my view of force on force is just fighting none stop (except to respond) for an extended period of time.  That is not possible in EW.  If you die, you die.  You are "dead" for 2 hours (30 min for day players).  In force on force, nobody really cares if they die. They just respawn and get back into the fight.  EW doesn't have that so I don't think EW has force on force style of play.  But again, its all up to interpretation. 

MilSim is very difficult to put a single definition on.  Thus, I think I have decided to think the following:  There are levels of MilSim.  My MilSim, may not be your MilSim, because there are levels.  I apologize about my earlier post, I think I realized I was describing EASTWIND and not simply MilSim in general.  But I do think that my posts describe what I consider to be "great" MilSim.  So I wasn't that far off base because I was still answering original question.

@Dragon - I posted this question on the EW forums to see what that community felt about what MilSim is to them.  Some of them described almost exactly what I did.  But the following comes from Swayze, one of the guys who runs EW.  I thought it might be of interest to you.

I have paraphrased the quote....  Question: What do you consider good/ great MilSim.

... Everyone being on the same page....

...Which brings me back to one of the core pieces of advice I always give guys who are trying to start doing Milsim somewhere.  If you're area is "not ready for Milsim" do Police Sim.  While it is hard for guys to really grasp an opord when they are not used to it or really get into the role like guys at East Wind do once they sort of "fall in" it is very easy for guys to grasp what it takes to be criminal masterminds and the cops going after them.    Build engaging police sim scenarios with very small groups trying to pull off heists, move "product" from place to place, protect vital assets, raid opposing team assets and guys will very quickly get into it.  From there, it's simply a matter of easing forward into more and more mil and less and less police till next thing you know, you're running East Wind with the same guys you used to steal "drugs" from. 

His post kind of got me thinking.  What I feel EW has that basically no other event I have attended has had is this:

Under all the requirements, look, feel, of EW.  The thing that I just realized is that EVERYONE is on the same page.  In all the games, ops, events I have attended EW is only one that I can say has accomplished this effectively.  In your average games or ops, I have always had a moment of... wait, what is going on?  What are the rules again?  I thought that wasn't allowed.... etc.

Anyway, I thought his post about "Police Sim" might be of interest to you.  Hope it helps.

[Adam]

  Mil-sim, to me, is the application of military tactics and strategies in an environment that does not involve life and death in the literal sense.  What aspect of the military one scenario may simulate compared to the next is up to the people running the scenario.  Shooting a lot is just as military-oriented as humping your ruck through the mud and brush for two days without a weapon in hand.  Both take place in the military and both can be simulated in a considerably less stressful environment than the real world military.
  What makes good mil-sim is teamwork, communication, personal desire, and strong leadership (both in-game and behind the scenes).  My first experience with airsoft (note: airsoft, not just mil-sim) was in Rushville, MO, in a game put on by KCAA.  Fever, Boomer, and I sat on a hill for three hours watching the OpFor through a spotting scope.  We did no shooting.  We just radioed troop movements and locations to our Command.  At least one OpFor patrol was "taken out" thanks to the information we provided, and in spite of a horrendous chigger infestation I still think of that as my favorite airsoft moment.
  Though I'm typing it out now it should go unsaid that capable Admins are just as important for mil-sim as they are in any other type of game or scenario.  The people running the show need to be able to decide from one moment to the next what is and isn't working and adjust accordingly.  If they put up too many questions to the players in the midst of a game then the players are no longer playing; they become admins as well.  Strong leadership behind the scenes helps just as much to make an excellent game as strong leadership within the game.

  My two cents on the matter: do not try to appease everyone.  Build the scenario that you want to play.  Chances are very good that there are others who want to play it, too.

[netshark993]

Vehiciles. i personally think that some of thelocal games should incorporate vehicles to some degree.

[Dragon]

Vehiciles. i personally think that some of thelocal games should incorporate vehicles to some degree.

The big issue with vehicles...

 Official Transports, and jeeps, and APCs, and Tanks... don't exactly grow on trees for Civis to pick up.  Surplus sellers of these, want as much if not more than a new car or motorcycle in many cases.

( There's a dude down in fayetteville, selling Swiss type vehicles, they are not even street legal for the US.
10,000 smackers is his asking price.. and they probably don't even run that great.)

They do and will add an element to the game or Environment of an Event sure.  I love to see them too...
but, most the time, they just aren't practically available , unless your BIG in operations. 

[Dragon]

@ BGallion,
 I understand what you meant by what you said, and even more clearly now.

 On Police SIM... I do have two Events I'd like to run, based off those actually... One is a complete scenario set up for play at the Bunker ( at the time), it may need some revision later. The Other is an Idea in progress.

OP Rapid Strike

(the Basics)
A Joint effort of US DEA Agents team up with the Colombian National Police for yet another assault on Cartel Controlled Drug Trafficking.
Columbian Drug lords , primarily the Cali Cartel has made a come back. The Cali cartels remaining members, bound together in a large push, subverting total control of the Colombian Marxists guerrilla groups.
While the Colombian National police and DEA had been chasing the minor groups and gangs, controlling production and distribution in the jungles and mountains of Columbia... the Cali Cartell, implanted themselves first in Mexico, then onto US soil.
Efforts were doubled by the DEA in Colombia , as reports of high end drugs were on the rise in the US, and for a time Oblivious as to how or why.

" We have fought this war for years now, thought were getting the upper-hand for once. It seemed though, as if every lab we raised to the ground, for every gang we put down... more and more powder was being distributed in our cities and streets. It didn't make sense!"

The Cali Cartell did in the US, what the cartels had been doing for generations in their own country, establishing hard to trace compounds, labs, and a highly funded underground network right under the DEA's noses, on US soil.

Eventually, one member of the Cali Cartel, threatened by rivals with-in the organized crime ring, came forward to the DEA, and struck a deal. The information he provided was key to locating and beginning to take the war from Columbia, to the US.

However, the Cali Cartel, always seemed one step ahead of the DEA, and none of it's ranking members were getting caught in any raid on any compound.
It is rumored the Cartel has inside informants in the DEA itself.

Unknowingly to the Cartel though, Nasa had secretively launched a Special Operations satellite, under the guise of yet another global positioning unit transmitter/receiver, allowing the DEA and CIA to set up a sophisticated and updated "spy satellite". The Details of this satellite, remain classified.

Armed with this next generation of of tracking and spying equipment, the DEA were able to locate Key locations, and push the Cartel off the coastal regions.

The secret Spy satellite, has now tracked the bulk of the Cartel Operations, into a rural, almost burned out town in the Mid West of the United States.
The DEA decided to act as quickly as possible, hoping to catch the entire cartel , in one rapid sweep of the location.

However, like almost anytime,... the DEA needed the help of the Military, and the DoD was slow on issuing any commands to deploy and help the DEA do so.

As the US prepared for a Rapid Strike , which became slow , and red tape laden to get off the ground, the Cali cartel got wind of the Operation, and decided to dig in for once.
No longer content with running, or playing Cat and Mouse games, the Colombians instead pulled in what resources they could from their underground network allies. A variable army of Colombian Marxists guerilla groups , along with the Cartel gang soldiers, and possibly Private Military Contractors , all holed up in the rural town, fortifying it against the expected attack.

The DEA wants to end this war on Drugs, and the Cartels want to make a stand, and show the world they will continue to do what they do, no matter what the DEA throws at them.

The DEA now has access to Military Soldiers at their command, and are now ready to begin their Rapid Strike.

Game elements I thought of

1- Location of this OP, as it could be quite large... I was thinking DDAY Park if we can secure it. It has the " town " and burned out look that would fit perfect with the OP, along with enough room and area to support large cast of Operators.

2- Teams Involved:

1- DEA
2- US Army

3- Cartel Members
4- Colombian Marxists guerrilla fighters

Thats about as far as I got...

 BUT... it seems there is very little interest in "playing cops and robbers" in airsoft-land.  Not really sure why...

I kinda had the same thoughts as above at one time.

[Adam]

I don't know about you guys, but I've seen a lot of government agencies dressed up like SF units in Afghanistan.  DEA in particular.  I don't remember the name of their unit, but you can see videos on YouTube.  They wear more MultiCam than the regular Army does.
  Simulation of any kind, whether it goes under the Police or Military monicker, is almost always more fun that straight force on force.  Having an objective beyond "capture this and bring it here" is all that's needed to peak my interest.

  Personally, I love the idea of going in as a Contractor or Agency type.  Many of their tactics are no different than their military counterparts, and the majority of them are former Active Duty personnel.  The scenario described above is definitely something I'd be in to playing, should other details come to light.

[Dragon]

I am a fan of more "modern" types of MilSim or PolSim hands down.  
Mostly because that's the gear I have and can easily obtain nowadays.  Not to mention the fact, that newer modernized gear is more functional, with less quirks than your standard surplus finds out there.

 I agree with Agents in that regard too.

I've seen them, with more PMC looking loads... I've seen em look like security guards of a shopping mall, in suits or nice clothes with protection vest on... lol, and even in various camo options in different areas.

 The above snippet, is more or less just a "back-ground" story, which I like including so operators actually know what's going on. I really dislike... showing up for something, and they say... " ok, you guys in Tan are Insurgents, You in Green are Marines. Now Go!" , or This is  a BlueFor vs Opfor event! <<< Those things just don't give you any reason to put anything but BBs into it.

 Some players don't care much for LARPing the scenarios... I wasn't sure if I would or not, but after OKi6... the Civi interactions made me think twice, and really give it thought.  Immersing oneself into the environment and game would add an element that makes it more "real" in my eyes.
So the backgrounds are there for Operators to decide if there's any element there that appeals to them for one side or the other, and gives some background info , in case there's a verbal communication of any sort between opposing teams, or extras included into the scenario.
LARPing in this manner isn't "forced" , but can be there if the Operators choose to partake in it.

That's about as far as I got though on the "idea".  
Actual Objectives and Missions, would be based on.. Area of play, availability of props, and of course, subject to the scenario Teams in appropriate aspects.  Meaning:
The Cartel sided faction, would be trying to fend off any opposition, away from their money, leaders, and "production"... ect. Possibly hit and run guerrilla tactics. the list is limitless. Just think like a Criminal.
The DEA would need to do Recon on the area. Find key locations and Key targets. They might decide to kill, or capture...
There may be Civis caught in-between??? Cartels like having captives to use as ransom to get out of fixes... maybe the DEA has to figure out how to extract the Civis, with-out getting em killed?
Again.. possibilities.

Not knowing, how many operators would like to do this... where it would be held ( no guarantee on DDAY Park ATM ) ... or any real solid specifics, it sits in my "creation pile" collecting dust.

[netshark993]

it dosent have to be the exact same thing, i'm just starting a m3 stewart build using a small tractor as my base. ive seen some pics and vids of simple but sweet conversions
As for milsim, i like it to be on the slightly casual side. gun restrictions turn me away from it, as i am not a fan of most more modern weapons. I am however interested in some of the WW2 based milsim games.

[det. mcclane]

See, now you're speaking my language. Personally, I've grown kinda bored with milsim in general. I don't have a problem with people that like it, but to me it just seems kinda boring. I've been there, done that in regards to hardcore milsim games and now I'm on the lookout for newer, interesting scenarios.

I think a DEA/Columbian Druglord type game would be a lot of fun, I'd definitely be up for something like that. Who wouldn't want to run around with a MAC 10, a straw fedora, and a Hawaiian Shirt? I'm up for Larping it up, lol.

Here a few of the different gametypes I've been salivating over the last couple of years.
http://www.nationalairsoftmagazine.com/biohazard.html    Operation Biohazard is a zombie game with all sorts of objectives, pistols and shotguns only. Looks like all kinds of fun, however when I emailed them to ask about them coming near the midwest they said they had talked to several of the larger milsim groups here. As you are probably guessing, there was absolutely no interest.

http://airsoftpacific.com/viewtopic.php?t=30012  Manicotti 2: Temple of the Moon Escapade is an all out adventure game. Armed with nothing but pistols, you gotta go after a professor who has been taken into the jungle. You have to deal with the local goverment, jungle traders, and mercenaries. I've seen the pictures and this looks pretty freaking awesome. If I lived anywhere near there, you can believe I'd be there every year.
http://www.codenamethunder.com/ This is kind of along the lines of what you posted, but on a pretty massive scale. One of these summers, probably next year, I am going to this event come hell or high water. US troops trying to shut down a drug lord, oh yeah!
Thes

[Dragon]

Thats me as well.

 I like MilSim. I enjoy it more than basic respawn and and shoot at another group and that's all you do. CTF, I've not really gotten any of those to work right in any case, but seems more like a "game" in itself.
 I do enjoy the F on F as well, don't get me wrong, because, well.. it's a way to practice skills, find out what your equipment can do, work out any kinks that might hinder your team in a MilSim OP...ect. Sometimes it' s nice just to have relaxed fun, .. and our triggerdays usually comprise mostly F on F types of games, because we are trying to get folks interested in airsoft, and see if there are any MilSim folks in that crowd that want to get to the "next level".. if not, well.. everyone gets to shoot and have fun, and that's what it' s about.

I don't enjoy being in situations where I'd be uncomfortable , to the point where the Event becomes un-enjoyable. That's why I stated, I can't or have the desire to take it to the level as Bgallion up there.
Realistically, I'm not THAT old... but at 36, I've pushed my body when I was young, suffered many injuries from the time I could walk until now, and I really have to pay attention to my limits and needs. I'd like to last another 36 years at least.  
I Used to "survival camp" twice a year , until just recently. The past couple of years... the enjoyment was replaced by arthritis, bruising easier by sleeping on the ground, and not being able to on limited amount of calories and water, and shrug it off like I used to.  
 I will still do this stuff, but not as hard core as I once would or could have. My body is just on the verge of wearing out in certain ways ... because in earlier times in my life,  i pushed, pushed, and pushed even more. I did it all, not knowing how it'd effect me physically later on.

 So an Event like Eastwind... , even though I'd give it all I could... there'd be a point where I'd have to fall out. Have to. It wouldn't matter if I didn't want to,... I would have to, or I might wind up laying up for 3 to 6 months. Or longer.
 Even at OKi6... I had my limits.  I went back to camp when I felt like it.
Now, there were guys out there.. that tried to do some finger-pointing over it, not at me specifically... but scoffing in general at everyone who didn't " go hard at it all day and night" ... as if THEY were better than anyone else, because they CHOSE to do the hard-core aspect and others didn't.
To that I say this...
5 , D-9 members held the town against overwhelming numbers ( 100+ a least against us.)  far longer than at any other time , when the town was occupied by any other force.  I with the DMR  recon'd routes and found insertion points into enemy territory for our Command. With same DMR.. I ate through lines of Opposition when it applied. I climbed up ravines, physically fit guys wouldn't follow me through. I did my duties just as hard as any one person out there did that didn't stop to go rest and eat, and poop!
 When I was "in game" I put it all I had in me into it.  So did my Team mates ( D-9) . Metal was on another team... but he also gave everything his 150%+ as well for his part of it.

My point is... I just can't do the things I used to enjoy that I did when I was a bit younger, and not prone to injuries.  I can and will push myself, but I must "listen" to my body when it starts groaning, for if I push it too far... I'm down and out for a long time.  So, I'd rather... take care of myself and miss out on a few hours of airsoft or MilSim, than to stay in and keep on keeping on until I'm down, and have to miss half a year or more of ALL Airsoft and MilSim.

 Anyhoo, back on topic here a bit...

I also have the mindset that just doing ONE aspect of airsoft, be it games, MilSim, PolSim ... is severely limiting myself.  I enjoy different scenarios, and events.  I want to experience as much as I can as a operator and player.   I'd.. rather partake in it all.
If that makes one person point his finger at me and say, " You're not MilSim ", well.. I guess maybe I am not, if that's what they think.

 So, different scenarios like you posted there Det.McClane ... are right up my alley as well.

zombie games.. I'd love to do one of those, with taste and "quality" myself.  Here's teh Inherient FLAW I see in those scenarios though...
No one wants to be the "zombies" and be shot continuously. Everyone wants to play the part of the "un-infected".  can't say I blame anyone in that department... so if there was  away to figure out how to over-come that flaw... I'd try to put up something like the Biohazard thing there.
Is it "MilSim" ... I dunno. Don't care... it could be fun, and if quality was put into it ... you could still have structure, and command, and missions inserted into it. maybe not  Milsim exactly, but it doesn't have to be entirely "just a game either".

The temple scenario.. again, looks fun.  I bet the environment there is amazing!
Dunno how I'd pull that one off either though.

 I kinda do like the "Drug Lord" types of avenues as well. First and foremost, it's Modern more or less. It' s stuff we all see and hear on the news. We can see ourselves in those situations, and there is literally tons of information and no ends to subject matter be it real life stuff, or fiction.  Maybe it isn't "MilSim" either.. not in the sense of Military vs Military at any rate.  

 Playing Army is cool.  Playing everything else, with that as well... in my eyes is even more fun and 'cooler".

Those are the reasons I say.. I can't get so "hard-core". I want to stay diverse.

@Netshark

As for milsim, i like it to be on the slightly casual side.

<< I too enjoy some relaxed "MilSim" events with less restrictions. Most of our Events are this way by default. Mostly cause we are trying to attract more folks into the hobby, with-out breaking the bank.
I've tried to get more "restrictive" on things like ammo counts, and using Casualty Collection Points( CCPs), instead of respawn, with stricter MED rules to enhance the game environment and play, as opposed to restricting because of this gear, or that weaponry.  The one time I put in extra Uniform requirements, has crippled OP FP in player counts so far. I since then, lessened those requirements.

gun restrictions turn me away from it, as i am not a fan of most more modern weapons. I am however interested in some of the WW2 based milsim games

On that matter, I'm just the opposite. I really don't like many of the WW2 era weapons... and the very few I do like, seem to be in boneyards and not so well made ( or can't get in the US anymore it seems.).
Plus, WW2 events usually involve Joint Forces, VRS german/nazi type of things... and I don't like seeing folks wearing "SS" stuff, or sporting Nazi symbols. Even if it's "fiction"... I think it's disrespectful, and very bad taste.
It's an easy "war" to pull information from, and I think everyone knows at least a little bit about it... so it's popular in that regard, cause folks can relate to the war itself.  I myself though... I'm still a more modern era lover.

If I really wanted to go Historical .. in airsoft... I'd like to be able to do a "Wild West" , outlaws, bandits, train robbers, gangs of cowboys, and the sheriffs, marshals, and bounty-hunters duking it out in an old town, and around it in the surrounding land.  Ya know.. gun fighters, and all that stuff.
But 4 things there...
1 - there aren't really any airsoft weapons designed from that era.
2- I am NOT riding any horses or farm animals.
3- I am NOT going to wear a cowboy hat. ( I look bad enough in a boonie, much less a stupid big hat.)
4- They didn't wear EyePro back then... might seem a bit out of place.

I still consider Desert Storm or around that time frame "Modern" , such as OP Irene... it wasn't that long ago. It's still period specific, but not so bad really.