Why no metal?

[Sarge]

This is a rather strange debate with very good points on both sides.

Basically the question is, why do most places ban metal bbs?

Before jumping to the obivous answers think of these points:
- You will assume that the bbs weigh exactly the same (an easily understandable achievement with heavier plastic bbs now days and lighter metal ones, its easy to match plastic and metal weight)
- You will assume they are being shot from the same gun
- You will assume this gun shoots the same FPS on every shot (although this is very difficult to achieve the median FPS should match on the gun over 10 shots regardless of the material of the bb, try it yourself if you dont beleive me. I.E. if you shoot 10 metal bbs at each of the following fps 245,250,245,250 then your median fps is 247.5 (which you will assume the gun will always fire at) and should be identical to the same gun shooting a plastic bb)

My opinion, thoughts, measurements, etc. will wait until I hear from you. I have had this topic discussed before and it can really bring out some interesting ideas (whether scientific or not is usually up for some debate).

[Tang]

Plastic BBs shatter at high speed, metal BBs don't at high speed. Plastic BBs doesn't break skin as much, metal BBs do break skin. Do you really want to be shot by them? I know this for sure, no one would want to play with you with metal BBs or any field that approves metal BBs. This message isn't meant to be mean or anything, just stating the obvious.

[Sarge]

Yes, I understand the principle. But the science isn't right. Its not even that obvious to most.

What I mean to say is, a metal bb and a plastic bb shot at your skin will hurt the exact same amount. Provided you assume all the other factors are the same (i.e. fps and wieght). This seems contradicatory to science but in actuality its not. Its the same mass traveling at the same speed. If it contacts your skin (which is a maleable object) all of the force will be transfered to your skin. The only thing that it would take into consideration is the hardness of the material of which the bb is made of, and then only if that directly corolates with the target the bb is striking.

In other words, when striking an object like skin the only thing that matters is the materials ability to disperse impact. Since high grade abs plastic and metal have very very similar hardness (when in 6mm ball configuration and when striking skin) it would not matter which hit you, it would hurt the same and do the same amount of damage. Because the ability of plastic to shatter has been almost negated by the superior manufacturing ability of the bb makers (at least in direct regard to the plastic striking skin) there is such a small difference in the ability of the material to disperse energy its virtually non-existent. Since our gear and skin is "maleable" it doesnt matter the material (assuming of course high grade plastic) because the hardness is almost identical.

In conclusion, although when shooting a non-maleable object (like a steel plate) a plastic bb would indeed shatter and thus transfer most of its energy away from the target wherein a metal bb would not, in the case of most gear and skin it would not matter which of the two materials the bb is made of  (because neither will shatter on skin impact, and rarely on gear impact). As for being shot by one, I have indeed been shot by one of identical weight to a plastic and it hurts no more or less than the plastic. The only reason I can see this rule is still around (as this was used when metal bbs weighed much more than plastic bbs could) is because its a mental thing. The science negates it, but I know a lot of people would be hesitant to play because of the thought process that metal hurts more than plastic.

[Supercell]

I don't have a lot of time for giving my opinion on this subject.  But I will say this.  Why use metal bb's when you say they are the same. 
Why bring metal bb's even into Airsoft when one of the main reason newbe parents don't like their kids getting into airsoft is because of their perception of the regular bb guns.  And with perception comes those who don't like airsoft anyway and then they use this as another excuse to ban Airsoft in city limits.  Since metal bb's don't break like the plastic ones and due to that won't be helping our cause for those who like to use their Airsoft guns for criminal actions and destroys property.
Even the harder good quatlity bb's are meant to loose their shape a bit if it needs to.  Hence another reason you don't reuse bb's.
Again, why even use metal bb's?  I haven't looked into them but don't they cost more?  And if that is the case another reason not to use, approve or even make metal bb's.
I know some Airsoft snipers that shoot targets with the metal bb's and I dont' see anything wrong with that of course.
Ok, I guess I had a little more time to put down some thoughts. lol
Cya at So Go Airsoft
Jon

[Sarge]

I agree with all of that, Jon. You show your wisdom of a seasoned player. I was hoping someone would bring this point up. I do think that for the most part its completely unnecessary because the cost is higher and there is no reason to freak people out. However, I know that as an extremely picky sniper, I do love the perfectness of a metal bb. They fly so consistently it's insane. I would love to use metal bbs in outdoor in 100ft+ engagement distance in my sniper rifle. This is about the only instance in which I can see that I would prefer to use these over plastic and even then its really not a big deal.

Side Note: The only pieces of gear that usually don't fit into the "maleable" category is eye protection, masks, and guns. Another reason to ban these bbs. I'm not at all against banning these, I just thought it makes for interesting topic of convo.

[Supercell]

You were right.  It at least made me talk about it. lol
Cya on the 27th.

Jon
So Go Airsoft

[bgallion]

My question is... if everything is the same (weight, diameter, etc.) then why is it that the metal bb supposedly has a straighter flight path, or flies more true?  My theory is that of density.  I very well may be wrong but I believe that even though the weight of the bb's are the same, the metal bb is more dense then the plastic bb, by the nature of the materials.  Thus, the metal bb would have more kinetic energy than the plastic bb.  Which as a result, the bb with more kinetic energy will inflict more damage on the target.  I believe this is why the metal bb is not effected by the elements as much... because, as a result of its density, it has more inertia than a plastic bb.

I have no research or definite knowledge on this subject.  This is simply what I think is correct.  My science/ physics could be way off.

[Zach]

I think someone needs to call up the mythbusters to see if they will help us out.

[Boba Fett]

I think you're right Zach!

[Zach]

In all seriousness, it is simple physics. The plastic BB is more malleable and will deform as it hits the target. The metal BB will not dwarf as much and therefore has more force behind it.

Consider this. If you get in a reck in your car with an air bag, then your head will spend more time slowing down than you would if your head just hit the steering wheel; thus, you are less likely to become injured if you have an airbag. This is because it might take your head 2 seconds to slow down with an airbag rather than .2 seconds and therefore less damage will occur.

I believe the same logic could be applied to a bb.

[Sarge]

It does. The thing you aren't considering is the target that its hitting is MORE maleable than the object. I think i might have been clearer so let me be susinct now.

If the bb (plastic or metal) hits skin, shirts, or an object that is less "maleable" than itself; they will inflict the same amount of damage and pain.

If the bb is plastic and it hits an object that is less "maleable" than itself it should conform itself or shatter to release some of the impact.
If the bb is metal and it hits an object that is less "maleable" than itself it will not conform itself or shatter and therefore cause more damage than the plastic.

I hope this clarifies a few things. I am in no way against the banning of metal bbs. I just would like to use them for my sniper rifle in outdoor 100ft+ engagement. I do however like the conversation this brings up and the points that are brought out on both sides.

[Zach]

For the sake of argument, I do not believe that the material that the bb is hitting makes a difference as long as the object that the bb is hitting remains constant. What I am speaking for is force. Will a metal bb create more force on an object than a plastic bb. I feel that it is a yes.

Even if I am wrong about a metal bb creating more damage to skin than a plastic bb, that rule given does not apply to teeth, fingernails, and hard-boned areas like shins, fore-heads, and knees. It just seems to me that the cons outweigh the pros on this one.

Also, where can I find metal bbs for airsoft guns? I might try to back this one up (or ruin all of my feeble arguments) with actual data.

[Boba Fett]

Simple: Metal is harder than even hard plastics used for BBs; therefore it will transfer more energy into the person it hits.

[Sarge]

Simple: Metal is harder than even hard plastics used for BBs; therefore it will transfer more energy into the person it hits.

Only if the material its hitting is harder than the transfer limit of the material. I.E. This wouldnt apply on skin as its under the tranfer limit of both metal and plastic. This would apply on an aluminum plate as its transfer limit is over plastic but under a metal bb.

[Boba Fett]

Ok maybe I don't know what I'm talking about I thought it was simple...haha I'm not as good in science as some other subjects. haha